Any Ixder's working on physical products inthegroup?

3 Nov 2005 - 2:03pm
9 years ago
5 replies
290 reads
jstanford
2003

In answer to the original question, I am working on the design of some
physical phone related products and am happy to start a dialogue about that.

In terms of the ipod discussion below...I have an ipod and I love it *in
spite* of the interaction which frankly I often find confusing. Very
frequently, I am hitting the menu button at the wrong time instead of select
and I find the term "Menu" which really means "Back" on an iPod (sometimes)
to be very confusing and difficult to use. Having spoke with others, I know
that I am not alone in this observation.

I think it is interesting to note that I have an iPod anyway for the cool
factor and am not interested in the competitors. This is an issues that
we've been discussing a lot as I work on the physical device design that
we're currently working on.

Julie

_____________________________________
Julie Stanford
Principal, Sliced Bread Design | www.slicedbreaddesign.com
650-799-7225

> -----Original Message-----
> From: discuss-bounces at lists.interactiondesigners.com
> [mailto:discuss-bounces at lists.interactiondesigners.com] On
> Behalf Of Mark Canlas
> Sent: Thursday, November 03, 2005 11:11 AM
> To: 'Vishal iyer'; discuss at ixda.org
> Subject: Re: [IxDA Discuss] Any Ixder's working on physical
> products inthegroup?
>
> [Please voluntarily trim replies to include only relevant
> quoted material.]
>
> > Most Ixd discussions in this group are related to web/desktop
> > applications. Wondering if anyone working with design of physical
> > product is here? Looking to start a general dialogue
> specifically in
> > this area.
>
> A prime example I can think of is the iPod. Although software
> based, it is a device that occupies meatspace. One could
> argue that its interaction design transcends the desktop and
> pervades all layers of interaction, creating an...
> experience. Easy to download, easy to manage, easy to
> configure, easy to play...
>
> What is it? The iPod is "cool". That's pretty much it and
> pretty cool to me.
> =)
>
> And on an aside to physical design, I still think minimalism
> is nice/key. I think the iPod is very minimalistic. All the
> "iPod killers" out there seem so noisy/bulky. Why add all
> these unnecessary curves to design? The iPod is just a prism
> (?) with rounded edges.
>
> ________________________________________________________________
> Welcome to the Interaction Design Association (IxDA)!
> To post to this list ....... discuss at ixda.org
> (Un)Subscription Options ... http://subscription-options.ixda.org/
> Announcements List ......... http://subscribe-announce.ixda.org/
> Questions .................. lists at ixda.org Home
> ....................... http://ixda.org/ Resource Library
> ........... http://resources.ixda.org
>

Comments

3 Nov 2005 - 2:18pm
Dave Malouf
2005

HI everyone,

I wanted to add to the top line of this discussion as well.
I know for a fact there are people on this list from motorola, IDEO, Design
Continuum, Frog, Smart Design, Bose Corp (our President and one Board
member), and many many others who are here and don't work on the web or
desktop or even mobile software. They work on both the hard and soft and
sometimes just the hard side of things.

While the discussion happens to focus on issues of soft, I have always tried
to extrapolate them into the more general foundations of IxD, but it would
be great if people want to talk hardware, 3D, architecture, fashion, or any
other type of IxD influenced solutions.

To the iPod Question and the question of Cool.
What makes IxD's different from pure HCI people (I read it I the ID&A
magazine from Rome so it must be true) is that we care about desireability).
I think people should really read Emotional Design by D. Norman for some
good insights into thinking about the emotional side of design.

I also want to say that there are aesthetics of interactions. Movements are
flavors (can be individual) which bring about emotions themselves. Moving in
circles as opposed to straight lines for example. It connotes exploration as
opposed to harvesting in a metaphorical sense.

I would also add that a big piece of the success of the iPod including the
new video iPod is that it is a package deal. That the service & software +
the product in tandem make it work better than the others who either OEM the
service (musicmatch or napster or yahoo) and some of those are also the
management software too. This speaks to the greater principle of the power
of experience design (not just user experience design) where controlling and
designing all the touch points between human and brand is vital to product
or service success.

-- dave

On 11/3/05 3:03 PM, "Julie Stanford" <julie at slicedbreaddesign.com> wrote:

> [Please voluntarily trim replies to include only relevant quoted material.]
>
> In answer to the original question, I am working on the design of some
> physical phone related products and am happy to start a dialogue about that.
>
>
> In terms of the ipod discussion below...I have an ipod and I love it *in
> spite* of the interaction which frankly I often find confusing. Very
> frequently, I am hitting the menu button at the wrong time instead of select
> and I find the term "Menu" which really means "Back" on an iPod (sometimes)
> to be very confusing and difficult to use. Having spoke with others, I know
> that I am not alone in this observation.
>
> I think it is interesting to note that I have an iPod anyway for the cool
> factor and am not interested in the competitors. This is an issues that
> we've been discussing a lot as I work on the physical device design that
> we're currently working on.
>
> Julie
>
> _____________________________________
> Julie Stanford
> Principal, Sliced Bread Design | www.slicedbreaddesign.com
> 650-799-7225
>
>
>> -----Original Message-----
>> From: discuss-bounces at lists.interactiondesigners.com
>> [mailto:discuss-bounces at lists.interactiondesigners.com] On
>> Behalf Of Mark Canlas
>> Sent: Thursday, November 03, 2005 11:11 AM
>> To: 'Vishal iyer'; discuss at ixda.org
>> Subject: Re: [IxDA Discuss] Any Ixder's working on physical
>> products inthegroup?
>>
>> [Please voluntarily trim replies to include only relevant
>> quoted material.]
>>
>>> Most Ixd discussions in this group are related to web/desktop
>>> applications. Wondering if anyone working with design of physical
>>> product is here? Looking to start a general dialogue
>> specifically in
>>> this area.
>>
>> A prime example I can think of is the iPod. Although software
>> based, it is a device that occupies meatspace. One could
>> argue that its interaction design transcends the desktop and
>> pervades all layers of interaction, creating an...
>> experience. Easy to download, easy to manage, easy to
>> configure, easy to play...
>>
>> What is it? The iPod is "cool". That's pretty much it and
>> pretty cool to me.
>> =)
>>
>> And on an aside to physical design, I still think minimalism
>> is nice/key. I think the iPod is very minimalistic. All the
>> "iPod killers" out there seem so noisy/bulky. Why add all
>> these unnecessary curves to design? The iPod is just a prism
>> (?) with rounded edges.
>>
>> ________________________________________________________________
>> Welcome to the Interaction Design Association (IxDA)!
>> To post to this list ....... discuss at ixda.org
>> (Un)Subscription Options ... http://subscription-options.ixda.org/
>> Announcements List ......... http://subscribe-announce.ixda.org/
>> Questions .................. lists at ixda.org Home
>> ....................... http://ixda.org/ Resource Library
>> ........... http://resources.ixda.org
>>
>
> ________________________________________________________________
> Welcome to the Interaction Design Association (IxDA)!
> To post to this list ....... discuss at ixda.org
> (Un)Subscription Options ... http://subscription-options.ixda.org/
> Announcements List ......... http://subscribe-announce.ixda.org/
> Questions .................. lists at ixda.org
> Home ....................... http://ixda.org/
> Resource Library ........... http://resources.ixda.org

-- dave

David Heller
http://synapticburn.com/
http://ixdg.org/
Dave (at) ixdg (dot) org
Dave (at) synapticburn (dot) com
AIM: bolinhanyc || Y!: dave_ux || MSN: hippiefunk at hotmail.com

3 Nov 2005 - 3:42pm
penguinstorm
2005

On Nov-3-2005, at 12:03 PM, Julie Stanford wrote:

> Very
> frequently, I am hitting the menu button at the wrong time instead
> of select
> and I find the term "Menu" which really means "Back" on an iPod
> (sometimes)
> to be very confusing and difficult to use. Having spoke with
> others, I know
> that I am not alone in this observation.

Hmm. So you're suggesting there should be a separate "Menu" and
"Back" buttons?

I personally find myself always shutting it off when I mean to turn
the back light on. I'm not sure those are core functions, and I'm
pretty happy to have them cluttering the interface. Those iPods that
had 4 buttons across the top were ugly, and the scroll wheel wasn't
nearly as useful 'cause it was smaller...

My solution was to go back to setting the backlight to an automatic 2
seconds. Cuts battery life a bit, but solves my usability problem.
--
Scott Nelson
skot at penguinstorm.com
http://www.penguinstorm.com/

skype. skot.nelson

3 Nov 2005 - 4:03pm
penguinstorm
2005

On Nov-3-2005, at 12:18 PM, David Heller wrote:

> To the iPod Question and the question of Cool.
> What makes IxD's different from pure HCI people (I read it I the ID&A
> magazine from Rome so it must be true) is that we care about
> desireability).

Alan Cooper spoke about this a bit as the Puget Sound CHI lecture
last week.

> I would also add that a big piece of the success of the iPod
> including the
> new video iPod is that it is a package deal. That the service &
> software +
> the product in tandem make it work better than the others who
> either OEM the
> service

This integration has given the iPod an ease of use that can't be
beat. The only compelling argument that I've heard against the iPod
is that I can't take music from someone else's computer, put it on my
iPod and copy it off.

There are, of course, software solutions that make this happen.

This is, of course, also fairly clearly theft. There is also a way to
do it (using the iPod as a HD, rather than an MP3 player) so the
argument is a bit red herring.

Generally speaking, the ease of getting downloaded video onto the new
Video iPod makes it the first viable experiment into *portable* pay
as you go video that I've seen. It'll be interesting to see how the
service grows (if it does) and how users requests, complaints and
comments shape Release 2.0

The quality of the video is quite low. I am viewing this as an
experiment as a precursor to the delivery of full broadcast quality
video to a future device.
--
Scott Nelson
skot at penguinstorm.com
http://www.penguinstorm.com/

skype. skot.nelson

3 Nov 2005 - 6:18pm
Vishal Subraman...
2005

> While the discussion happens to focus on issues of soft, I have
always tried
> to extrapolate them into the more general foundations of IxD, but it
would
> be great if people want to talk hardware, 3D, architecture, fashion,
or any
> other type of IxD influenced solutions.

We have discussed many issues (both specific and general) related to
web/software. For starters how do you think they relate to physical
products? What are the similarities/differences?

General foundations of Ixd would be a great direction to go.
My fav resources are The Art of Innovation (Tom Kelly, IDEO) and The
Design of Everyday Things (Norman). What other books are oriented
towards the such? Discussions on the above two books would be great too...

Vishal
http://vishaliyer.com

David Heller wrote:
> [Please voluntarily trim replies to include only relevant quoted material.]
>
> HI everyone,
>
> I wanted to add to the top line of this discussion as well.
> I know for a fact there are people on this list from motorola, IDEO, Design
> Continuum, Frog, Smart Design, Bose Corp (our President and one Board
> member), and many many others who are here and don't work on the web or
> desktop or even mobile software. They work on both the hard and soft and
> sometimes just the hard side of things.
>
> While the discussion happens to focus on issues of soft, I have always tried
> to extrapolate them into the more general foundations of IxD, but it would
> be great if people want to talk hardware, 3D, architecture, fashion, or any
> other type of IxD influenced solutions.
>
> To the iPod Question and the question of Cool.
> What makes IxD's different from pure HCI people (I read it I the ID&A
> magazine from Rome so it must be true) is that we care about desireability).
> I think people should really read Emotional Design by D. Norman for some
> good insights into thinking about the emotional side of design.
>
> I also want to say that there are aesthetics of interactions. Movements are
> flavors (can be individual) which bring about emotions themselves. Moving in
> circles as opposed to straight lines for example. It connotes exploration as
> opposed to harvesting in a metaphorical sense.
>
> I would also add that a big piece of the success of the iPod including the
> new video iPod is that it is a package deal. That the service & software +
> the product in tandem make it work better than the others who either OEM the
> service (musicmatch or napster or yahoo) and some of those are also the
> management software too. This speaks to the greater principle of the power
> of experience design (not just user experience design) where controlling and
> designing all the touch points between human and brand is vital to product
> or service success.
>
> -- dave
>
>
> On 11/3/05 3:03 PM, "Julie Stanford" <julie at slicedbreaddesign.com> wrote:
>
>
>>[Please voluntarily trim replies to include only relevant quoted material.]
>>
>>In answer to the original question, I am working on the design of some
>>physical phone related products and am happy to start a dialogue about that.
>>
>>
>>In terms of the ipod discussion below...I have an ipod and I love it *in
>>spite* of the interaction which frankly I often find confusing. Very
>>frequently, I am hitting the menu button at the wrong time instead of select
>>and I find the term "Menu" which really means "Back" on an iPod (sometimes)
>>to be very confusing and difficult to use. Having spoke with others, I know
>>that I am not alone in this observation.
>>
>>I think it is interesting to note that I have an iPod anyway for the cool
>>factor and am not interested in the competitors. This is an issues that
>>we've been discussing a lot as I work on the physical device design that
>>we're currently working on.
>>
>>Julie
>>
>>_____________________________________
>>Julie Stanford
>>Principal, Sliced Bread Design | www.slicedbreaddesign.com
>>650-799-7225
>>
>>
>>
>>>-----Original Message-----
>>>From: discuss-bounces at lists.interactiondesigners.com
>>>[mailto:discuss-bounces at lists.interactiondesigners.com] On
>>>Behalf Of Mark Canlas
>>>Sent: Thursday, November 03, 2005 11:11 AM
>>>To: 'Vishal iyer'; discuss at ixda.org
>>>Subject: Re: [IxDA Discuss] Any Ixder's working on physical
>>>products inthegroup?
>>>
>>>[Please voluntarily trim replies to include only relevant
>>>quoted material.]
>>>
>>>
>>>>Most Ixd discussions in this group are related to web/desktop
>>>>applications. Wondering if anyone working with design of physical
>>>>product is here? Looking to start a general dialogue
>>>
>>>specifically in
>>>
>>>>this area.
>>>
>>>A prime example I can think of is the iPod. Although software
>>>based, it is a device that occupies meatspace. One could
>>>argue that its interaction design transcends the desktop and
>>>pervades all layers of interaction, creating an...
>>>experience. Easy to download, easy to manage, easy to
>>>configure, easy to play...
>>>
>>>What is it? The iPod is "cool". That's pretty much it and
>>>pretty cool to me.
>>>=)
>>>
>>>And on an aside to physical design, I still think minimalism
>>>is nice/key. I think the iPod is very minimalistic. All the
>>>"iPod killers" out there seem so noisy/bulky. Why add all
>>>these unnecessary curves to design? The iPod is just a prism
>>>(?) with rounded edges.
>>>
>>>________________________________________________________________
>>>Welcome to the Interaction Design Association (IxDA)!
>>>To post to this list ....... discuss at ixda.org
>>>(Un)Subscription Options ... http://subscription-options.ixda.org/
>>>Announcements List ......... http://subscribe-announce.ixda.org/
>>>Questions .................. lists at ixda.org Home
>>>....................... http://ixda.org/ Resource Library
>>>........... http://resources.ixda.org
>>>
>>
>>________________________________________________________________
>>Welcome to the Interaction Design Association (IxDA)!
>>To post to this list ....... discuss at ixda.org
>>(Un)Subscription Options ... http://subscription-options.ixda.org/
>>Announcements List ......... http://subscribe-announce.ixda.org/
>>Questions .................. lists at ixda.org
>>Home ....................... http://ixda.org/
>>Resource Library ........... http://resources.ixda.org
>
>
> -- dave
>
> David Heller
> http://synapticburn.com/
> http://ixdg.org/
> Dave (at) ixdg (dot) org
> Dave (at) synapticburn (dot) com
> AIM: bolinhanyc || Y!: dave_ux || MSN: hippiefunk at hotmail.com
>
>
>
> ________________________________________________________________
> Welcome to the Interaction Design Association (IxDA)!
> To post to this list ....... discuss at ixda.org
> (Un)Subscription Options ... http://subscription-options.ixda.org/
> Announcements List ......... http://subscribe-announce.ixda.org/
> Questions .................. lists at ixda.org
> Home ....................... http://ixda.org/
> Resource Library ........... http://resources.ixda.org
>

4 Nov 2005 - 10:51pm
David Paneque
2005

How nice is that,

I’m very enthusiast to read about the discussion theme is taking relevance at the moment on the list. (Hard-User Interaction Design)

I would like to thank the different links that Hari Vepadharmalingam told us. The HIT labs and also the Iroshi Ishi’s MIT Media Labs are working on that too, I think they’re searching for future paradigms, something very interesting to provide us (to the human) new kind of relationships with the merging technologies.

In this way and related to the concepts and ideas are involved on the discipline of IxD, I would like to put in this discussion my personal point of view.

I saw lots of comments that are talking about UxD and IxD when they are talking about GUI Design, why we doesn’t use this concept when we’ll talk about Soft IxD ? what do you think about that? Am I wrong?

In other side, I read about IxD and UxD, and I think we are using those disciplines when we would define the different strategies that the designes do use for improve and optimize the relationship of human with technologies. When would talk about that on a generic way I think we could define the actuation field of UxD and the IxD as Human Technological Objects Interaction (H-to-I) or something like that: Human Technologies Interaction (H-t-I) in analogy to the specific field of HCI when a IxDesigner works on Interaction between Human and Computers. What do you think about those Ideas?

Thank you,

David Paneque.

budpirep en yahoo.com

PD. I’m Sorry about my English. It isn’t my mother language.

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