RE: Digest, Vol 4, Issue 7

12 Jan 2004 - 11:58pm
924 reads
Naznin Rao

this word "feed forward which i have just read in one of the mails by Gerard
has been bothering me since quite some time... Please give me some more
references or explanations about what it is and is there a process to it.
e.g. feedforward interviews- what they mean and what exactly should one be
aiming to get out of them .


National Institute of Design,
Paldi, Ahmedabad.

M: 9845825638

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Subject: Digest, Vol 4, Issue 7

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Today's Topics:

1. design guidelines for a wizard (Jerry John)
2. Re: Links to new windows (Ron Vutpakdi)
3. Re: Links to new windows (Gerard Torenvliet)
4. Re: design guidelines for a wizard (Dan Saffer)
5. RE: design guidelines for a wizard (Lord, Ralph)
6. discussion archives, the lack of (ben hyde)


Message: 1
Date: Mon, 12 Jan 2004 10:24:19 +0530
From: "Jerry John" <jerry at>
Subject: [ID Discuss] design guidelines for a wizard
To: <discuss at>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1"

hi my name is jerry and i'm a student at National Institute of Design, India
doing a course in New Media.

I'm into my internship. I have been assigned a task to design wizards for a
complex fire wall application - i know the basics,

Look at the exsisting tadk flow - smplifiy it, map the process, and the
designing the wizard - well that the point- how do you design the wizard,
what should it do, what should it say ...

Pls get back to me -


Message: 2
Date: Mon, 12 Jan 2004 08:24:58 -0800 (PST)
From: Ron Vutpakdi <vutpakdi at>
Subject: Re: [ID Discuss] Links to new windows
To: discuss at
Message-ID: <20040112162458.12311.qmail at>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii

--- jaubin <jaubin at> wrote:
> RE: PDF [2]
> I agree that PDF's can also be a pain (re: Jacob Nielson
> ) But they still do have one good
> thing: they disable the possibility of copying a document. ( so far, not

How do PDFs disable the possibility of copying a document? You can easily
save the PDF to a local copy of the file. Unless the PDF is protected, you
can also select parts of the PDF and copy out the text. Most PDFs do not
appear to be so protected.

It seems to me that the main advantages of PDFs are that paper documents
can be made portable and that the paper documents can be displayed to the
screen or printed out on whatever printer is locally available,
irrespective of what was available when the document was generated.

I do agree that PDF links should be so marked. I also happen to find PDFs
to be very useful as long as they are used properly and not a lazy way to
avoid generating proper web content.


Ron Vutpakdi
vutpakdi at

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Message: 3
Date: Mon, 12 Jan 2004 11:32:49 -0500
From: "Gerard Torenvliet" <g_torenvliet at>
Subject: Re: [ID Discuss] Links to new windows
To: dan at, at
Message-ID: <Law9-F102VCbG5f75Rd0001518d at>
Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed

Dan Saffer wrote:

>By the way, there's a term for this, coined by Tom Djajadiningrat, Kees
>Overbeeke and Stephan Wensveen at ID StudioLab in The Netherlands:

Just a note -- Djajadiningrat, Overbeeke, and Wensveen did not *coin* the
term 'feedforward'. Instead, they *co-opted* it from the domain of control

(See if
you want to learn more than you ever wanted to know about feed-forward

They have a fine use of the term; I just raise this point to ensure that we
don't forget about the control-theoretic heritage of it.


P.S. The paper referenced *does* completely muddle the concept of
affordances -- to its detriment.

P.P.S. It's Monday morning; I'm feeling curmudgeonly. :-)

MSN 8 with e-mail virus protection service: 2 months FREE*


Message: 4
Date: Mon, 12 Jan 2004 11:50:02 -0500
From: Dan Saffer <dan at>
Subject: Re: [ID Discuss] design guidelines for a wizard
To: "Jerry John" <jerry at>
Cc: discuss at
Message-ID: <5DDA54CC-451F-11D8-A6B2-000A9573E3EC at>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed want us to do your homework for you? :)

IBM developerWorks has some guidelines for wizards you might want to

And if you are into patterns, there's Martin van Welie's Wizard Pattern:

Good luck!



Message: 5
Date: Mon, 12 Jan 2004 14:48:59 -0500
From: "Lord, Ralph" <rsl3 at>
Subject: RE: [ID Discuss] design guidelines for a wizard
To: "Jerry John" <jerry at>,
<discuss at>
<4FF34E33B7A33B4283BD068D31EF42C354A2F4 at>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"

I didn't have time to read the whole post, but here's some guidelines
for designing a wizard:

1. pointy hat - all wizards must have a pointy hat (stars and moons or
rune-like symbols make good decorations for the hat)

2. magic staff - size really does matter here. Fairy godmothers and
witches have magic wands. Wizards (and warlocks) have really big magic
staffs. Rap and hip-hop stars have big staffs, too, but they perform
more of a ceremonial role and carry the guns.

3. long beard - don't give your wizard a big bushy beard. That just
makes him look like an anorexic Santa with the wrong clothes. Which
brings to mind:

4. gauntness - lean, gaunt wizards look wiser and scarier than plump,
healthy ones. Exhibit A: who would make a more convincing wizard? - Phil
Jackson or Ruben Studdard?

5. Tall - who ever heard of a short wizard? (ok, Yoda doesn't count,
although he does exhibit many wizardlike qualities, he's just too dang
short) Not guiness book of records tall, but at least NBA forward tall.

6. piercing gaze - don't give your wizard bambi eyes. Make sure his gaze
is steely and can also exhibit a "seeking with the mind's eye" far-off
look when he wants to be left alone.

7. clear diction - nothing worse than a wizard who mumbles his
incantations and pronouncements of doom. People will just treat him
like their crazy grandfather if they can't understand what he's saying.

8. smoke bombs and flash grenades - he'll need a good supply of these
for dramatic entries and exits

9. pockets - lots and lots of pockets (this is so often overlooked and
causes some really good wizards to suffer from not being able to carry
enough stuff) in his:

10. flowing robe - or kimono or sari or whatever you want to call it.
Lots of room for personal tastes here, just stay away from pants and

11. and lastly - NO FEET - OK, he's going to have some feet, but don't
show them, ever. There's no way to make a wizard's feet look good. If
it's summer, it's ok for them to walk around barefooted (and bare feet
are the best feet for a wizard), but at any other time there's just not
any kind of appropriate wizard footwear. Yes, sandals will do in a
pinch, but boots? Sneakers? Rockports? (which is probably what he's
really wearing under the robes, you know, he's old and they have great
support). No, shoes and feet pose too many difficulties, just keep them

OK, I hope this cursory look at some design guidelines for a wizard
helps. Good luck with your wizard!



Message: 6
Date: Mon, 12 Jan 2004 19:51:08 +0000 (GMT)
From: ben hyde <hydeben at>
Subject: [ID Discuss] discussion archives, the lack of
To: discuss at
Message-ID: <20040112195108.19296.qmail at>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1"

Just a thought - but why isn't the archive of messages available for this
list? Rather than me having to keep them all in my mailbox so I can refer
back to something written previously, surely it would be easier to have an
archive - even if it is only available to subscribers. Maybe this is to
avoid spammers? But some list software manages to get around this by hiding
addresses - even yahoo groups ;) I for one would like to be able to check
back over the recent discussions to see what gems I have missed.

Appologies for the attachments sent with my messages - i know this is a pain
for some users - it is not intensional [deliberate spelling mistake*] -
something yahoo mail seems to do 'for me'.

* NetWORKers and their Activity in Intensional Networks

cheers, ben

jaubin <jaubin at> wrote:

RE: Ellipsis at end of of link [1]
RE: PDF [2]

[1] From: "Anirudha Joshi" January 12, 2004 1:07 PM
"It is a nice idea to use ... (ellipsis) at the end of the link to indicate
a new window. This has become almost a GUI standard. I remember someone once
told me that anything with a ... opens a new window long ago, and that was
it. I remembered for ever. Anirudha"

[2] From:Hoekema, Jim {PBG}> January 09, 2004 1:07 PM
"It always bothers me when links on a website lead to a new window when I'm
not expecting, especially when they open a PDF. For that matter, it bothers
me when I do expect a new window and it doesn't happen (an external site).
It seems to me this is an area where the web could use a new convention, so
that users would better understand the consequences of an interaction before
taking it.

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